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Post by robertlanger on May 21, 2022 11:52:38 GMT
[...] Secondly, I would like to confirm that my Bank knob is actually accessing every sound sample. My test patch for this is TOPOGRAF TRIG 1 -> each DRUMKIT channel, one by one -> DRUMKIT OUT -> MIXER 4-4 A1 channel -> I/O port 2 -> to Fostex recorder and speakers. No other synth lines are patched. Here are the results of that test patch. Format: LINE: # of samples played from rotating Bank from fully-left to fully-right; knob positions of samples (knob range, in percent, from left to right). BD: 1 sample, full knob rotation. SD: 3 unique samples; Sample A (0-40), B (40-65), C (60-75), B (75-100). CP: 3 unique samples; Sample D (0-25), E (25-50), F (50-57), D (57-70), E (70-100).
CH: 2 unique samples; Sample G (0-30), H (30-42), G (42-53), H (53-75), G (75-100).
OH: 4 unique samples; Sample I (0-51), J (51-62), K (62-72), L (72-82), K (82-100).
FX: zero unique samples (all sound identical to previous samples but the whining from the module is hurting me and I can't listen anymore); all spread out accessibly but heavily front-loaded.
[...]
The arrangement of the samples look fine; basically, the DRUMKIT module has only 11 different samples, that are assigned in different combinations by the bank knob. No space for more samples in the used chip...  |
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Post by tIB on May 27, 2022 7:19:51 GMT
Brilliant, thanks!
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Post by tIB on May 28, 2022 19:39:29 GMT
...and that's mine fixed!
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Post by maydonpoliris on May 29, 2022 4:33:03 GMT
mine is fixed now too. wasn't pretty melted the plastic on the outs and almost lost the 23 but its done and the modulation on the pitch cv is ok now and the volume cancellation through the faders gone too......to my ears anyway. thankyou very much.
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S&E
Full Member
Posts: 116
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Post by S&E on May 29, 2022 8:50:13 GMT
Hello guys! First, my sincere apologies for the nasty issue with the DRUMKIT010 and even more for the long period of silence from my side.  I almost can't believe it is two years ago this thread has started! For some reasons I lost this problem out of sight *shame* Ok, now let's go for fixing the issue; two different ways: 1 - The DIY way:The output filter, that blocks the PWM carrier frequency (this is what you hear) can be modified by adding a capacitor of 1nF across R23, at the top left side of the board, see here: View AttachmentThe value of the capacitor can be changed; choosing a larger one (e.g. 2.2nF) makes the filtering stronger (at the cost of loosing more higher freuqency components), a smaller one (e.g. 470pF) leaves more of the highs intact, but with less filtering of the nasty carrier frequency. If there are already manual modifications made on your module, please PM me so we can check it in detail. 2 - The tangible waves support way:If soldering is not yours, you can send us the module of course for fixing the issue without cost, no matter when it was purchased. Some more background info:- The (annoying) carrier frequency changes with the settings of the pitch knob from 15kHz to 30kHz, and this four times over the turning range of the pitch knob. So you have a much higher "noise pitch" e.g. a bit left of the middle position and here, the PWM carier frequency should be out of the hearing range - maybe worth a try!
- Soon after this issue came up, I was planning an updated version of the DRUMKIT010 module, with a real digital-to-analog converter avoiding the PWM noise; unfortunately, the last period of time brought some unpleasant surprises, consuming a lot of time to deal with, therefore I lost this issue out of sight, honestly. But the updated DRUMKIT is still on my list and I hope I can get it done in the second half of this year.
Does this issue still exist on drum modules purchased currently? What does an updated module mean? |
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Post by tIB on May 29, 2022 10:17:29 GMT
mine is fixed now too. wasn't pretty melted the plastic on the outs and almost lost the 23 but its done and the modulation on the pitch cv is ok now and the volume cancellation through the faders gone too......to my ears anyway. thankyou very much. Not the nicest job - r23 didn't make the cut on mine... I should probably check that will be ok. |
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Post by maydonpoliris on May 29, 2022 10:39:51 GMT
mine is fixed now too. wasn't pretty melted the plastic on the outs and almost lost the 23 but its done and the modulation on the pitch cv is ok now and the volume cancellation through the faders gone too......to my ears anyway. thankyou very much. Not the nicest job - r23 didn't make the cut on mine... I should probably check that will be ok. Bugger, Yeah I found out quickly it should have been a fast solder |
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Post by lukylutte on May 29, 2022 11:05:33 GMT
Ordered the part. Kinda small for my big shaky fingers but there is hope 🤞
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Post by waporwave on Jan 10, 2023 3:43:13 GMT
Good news, my 010 is here! Bad news, I lost a screw... oh and the noise is still an issue. I saw this post before buying but didn't browse the whole thing, and assumed roberts post about a DIY fix would mean that this issue would be fixed for any newer modules, but I hear the very loud screeching that has been talked about.
Also, something weird is occuring, I'm triggering the module with 1 pulse, and two rising signals, but even so, both are able to trigger it fine on 'D' trig mode. The weird part is that when I set it to 'A' they all still trigger the same, but are very noticably quieter, to the point where making them audible on the mixer introduces a lot of noise. Maybe the wiki has the functionality of this switch backwards?? Either way it's very unwanted behaviour. Some other things I noticed: One of the open hat samples has some crackling, seemingly just in the sample itself. If you are able to change the samples, I would suggest removing the crackling.
Sometimes a open hat is super loud and distorted, I'm assuming this is because it's triggering twice due to my setup?
I like this module, and plan to do a lot of cool things with it, but I don't think it matches the quality I've seen from the other tangible waves modules. Because of the noise issue in particular, I don't think you should sell this without fixing it, or at least putting a warning on the store page. There's spots where there's no noise, so I can still use it, but it makes performing with the pitch knob not feasible, as well as just being very annoying for the ears when configuring it.
I will try the DIY approach tomorrow and see if that works.
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Post by waporwave on Jan 10, 2023 4:01:55 GMT
I've attached an audio file demonstrating the problems I mentioned previously (Warning, it's not a pleasant listen) It plays in this order: Noise on the leftmost pitch position The volume difference when switching to 'A' trig mode (on the 8th CH hit) and then turning the volume up to show the noise that introduces Crackling on OH (On 'A' mode because it the crackle doesn't seem to change volume like the OH, maybe indicating where the issue might be?)
Screeching on OH when triggering quickly (Maybe this one isn't unexpected behaviour, but I consider it very unwanted especially for modular)
I've also attached images of the noise, which you can see by the waveform is as loud as the bass drum is, and two images of the OH crackling, one zoomed out to show it's regularity. You can also hear, there's cracking at the end of the CH section I recorded, which is the first time I've heard that, but looking at the waveform, it's the same downward spike as the CH.
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Post by waporwave on Jan 10, 2023 4:07:32 GMT
Oh one last thing: I showed the module to my dad because he wanted to see it. He seemed to like playing with the pitch knob a lot, so I asked about the noise, and it turns out he can't even hear it lol. Maybe something to keep in mind if you are testing solutions  |
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Post by waporwave on Jan 16, 2023 22:35:24 GMT
finally got my new soldering iron and did the 1nF as suggested. First off, hardest solder of my (short) soldering history! Second off, it did not remove the noise, though it's about half as loud. I might go back and add another 1nF (if series increases capacitance linearly, which im not sure of?), which could possibly be easier cause I have some stuck out wire, but it wont be pretty.
Robert, my experience with AE has been very positive, but this has by far been the most glaring issue to me. I cannot ignore those high frequency screams, so it essentially removes the whole functionality of the pitch knob. I implore you to put a warning on the store page. Not mad, but plz fix |
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Post by feijai on Nov 7, 2023 11:01:57 GMT
LINE: # of samples played from rotating Bank from fully-left to fully-right; knob positions of samples (knob range, in percent, from left to right). BD: 1 sample, full knob rotation. SD: 3 unique samples; Sample A (0-40), B (40-65), C (60-75), B (75-100). CP: 3 unique samples; Sample D (0-25), E (25-50), F (50-57), D (57-70), E (70-100).
CH: 2 unique samples; Sample G (0-30), H (30-42), G (42-53), H (53-75), G (75-100).
OH: 4 unique samples; Sample I (0-51), J (51-62), K (62-72), L (72-82), K (82-100).
FX: zero unique samples (all sound identical to previous samples but the whining from the module is hurting me and I can't listen anymore); all spread out accessibly but heavily front-loaded.
FX's sample order is as follows: Sample I (0-30), Sample J (30-40), Sample I (40-50), Sample J (50-60), Sample E (60-75), Sample B (75-85), Sample J (85-100).
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Post by 101 on Nov 7, 2023 13:34:08 GMT
Good that there is a DIY fixup for this. I found that mine was putting a high pitch whine on the bus (without any i/o to the module plugged in).
It wasn't until I removed the module from the board that the noise disappeared.
TBH I'm interested in Erica synths Pico drums in a pod if they could be triggered from Topograf. Most Eurorack trigger voltages seems to be 5v, though that's not universal. It's not always in the manufacturer specs either. And some could require higher or at least +5v to trigger. For example Moog allude to 0-5v in their specs sheets for the DFAM.
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I almost can't believe it is two years ago this thread has started! For some reasons I lost this problem out of sight *shame*
